They need to grow a pair
I feel like there’s a clear difference between shouting “that’s a corner ref” from wherever you are on the pitch and full on getting in the face/space of the ref amd shouting directly at him.
Football fans seem to have this odd aversion to punishing disrespectful and unnecessary behaviour towards officials lol
Because the refs are wank and I’m all for players screaming at them. Do they need a kiss and a tummy rub after the game to feel better?
I also love a good scrap between players themselves. If everyone’s getting booked all the time there’ll be none of either.
Respecting officials should be a basic element of the game regardless of quality. The standard of refereeing should be addressed in different ways than players screaming at them.
Taking action over dissent isn’t about making sure the refs don’t feel sad, it’s about maintaining decent standards and ensuring there is a platform for the referee to do a good job.
Not everything has to be directly linked. The refs can do better at their job and the players can also stop being cunts.
I get that your view is from the angle of an emotionally-invested fan but it’s obviously not practical as a serious approach to anything.
OK so let me ask you this, do you think dissent has gotten worse over the last 30 years? Or do we just talk about it more? Or has it always been a huge issue you think needed solving?
If you want more respect for referees there are plenty of ways to start helping them earn it. Microphones and explaining key decisions on the spot will do wonders for both players and fans understanding. Not that they will still necessarily agree with the decision, nor will it be a magic bullet, but it’d certainly help more than giving refs more power to mask their shit decisions.
And it’s not about being an emotionally invested fan just annoyed at reffing standards tbh, I see more and more passion being stripped from the game (can’t celebrate a big win, VAR ruining goal moments, refs warning players for showboating). Being frustrated at a decision and having a momentary go at the ref is part of the game, refs also know that when they sign up for the job.
Always been a big issue for me, I’ve brought this up numerous times on this forum.
Doesn’t seem to be an issue in rugby, where the players are actually tough, but soccer players, most of whom are not tough, seem to be unable to display any common decency.
I can’t think of any other sport that I follow where the refs get the kind of treatment from players that they do in football. Try shouting in the face of a ref in the NBA, instant technical foul at a minimum. Do it in rugby, 10 minutes on the sideline.
The whole “they need to earn it” mentality is impractical and is emotional fan talk. The game needs standards to be set and one of them should be respecting officials.
As above, showing some emotion at a decision is different to shouting in the refs face or grabbing him or crowding him aggressively etc as we see regularly in the prem.
It doesn’t have to be a related thing as you sort of imply. Refereeing standards can improve and so can player conduct. It doesn’t require each one to improve at the same rate to justify the other.
The stuff about passion I agree with, but it doesn’t really have anything to do with general disrespect of officials.
I agree with Bavin, but I believe, if a team set out with a good and positive conduct towards match officials, they would be at a major disadvantage to an opponent that has a Man Utd vs Andy D’Urso approach.
Well then our viewpoints just start from drastically different positions. For me it’s an act of passion from the players and it occurs more frequently the more shit decisions are given or perceived to be given, so they are tied and earned in my book.
I also just fundamentally don’t see a major problem with it, agree with you actually that it’s nothing new so I’m glad you said that, but again I haven’t had a problem with it for the last 20-30 years either.
Don’t really care what they do in rugby, they also use video technology much better and the game is at a completely different pace (largely boring imo). Comparing to rugby is pointless anyway, football as a sport has far more hooliganism, they’re just not the same and no guarantee the same measures would work, look at VAR lol.
You really want Neymar getting booked (or now sin binned) for doing a rainbow flick and then being pissed off when the ref warns him for it? Or he should just go ‘OK sorry almighty ref sir I won’t do any skills, thanks for your kind warning and cooperation’.
Definitely. The starting point should be respect and in fact it is on the surface with the handshakes etc but it only takes something as insignificant as a perceived wrong call on a throw in for that to go out the window.
Did this actually happen?
Yes, few years ago against Montpellier I believe.
Please don’t chop the getting annoyed about it but though - I’m not trying to hide he got booked for the resulting dissent, but he shouldn’t have even been warned for a skill to then be annoyed about.
I wasn’t chopping anything. I was asking a question cos I’d never heard of this.
And yea, you’ve probably found the most ridiculous example possible there to be fair and I doubt anyone is going to agree that refs should be making decisions like that. The respect thing absolutely works both ways of course.
That’s fine but you know how these things go, someone could pop in later acting like I’ve not been clear so just wanted to reiterate once I saw where you stopped the quote. Wasn’t having a go.
And of course I picked a ridiculous example to suit my point
No I wouldn’t want players getting booked for doing things that are legal lol
I also don’t think a history of hooliganism really justifies any kind of disrespectful behaviour by players towards referees. These are highly paid professionals, not a bunch of drunk goons off the street.
I personally don’t think chasing the ref around, grabbing at him, shouting in the face of the ref is just down to passion. It’s also disrespect. Regardless, something done out of passion isn’t automatically justified.
The point about other sports is that they show you can have a game and have a base level of respect for officials. Basketball moves at a faster pace than football and yet no antics there like we have in football.
The standard of refereeing can improve and so can the standard of player conduct.
That’s all fine but for me it’s part of this game and I like it
The main thing is, I think it naturally improves to a standard I’m happy to accept with better quality of refereeing and you think both angles need to be tackled independently.
OK, I’ve just randomly came across a show about the last weeks games and officiating, and they were disucssing a very very controversial penalty awarded to Newcastle against Bournemouth.
They have aired the whole VAR conversation which is super interesting and made a very surprising and complex decision in the end… For me su horribly wrong one.
I can’t see the videos on this site, I hope the conversation is available here.
Anyway you have the pen here too…
For me it’s crazy how they CONSTRUCTED the pen for Newcastle.
So just because the Bournemouth defender was pulling Shar’s shirt and did make a foul it cancels/erases his clear offside position?
How in the world?? If there wasn’t a foul and he gets the ball it’s off. How can the foul have the “supremacy” over the offside here?
I simply can’t wrap my head around it.
Webb says Schar maybe wouldn’t get the ball, maybe Botman would get it and shot, and the Shar maybe gets a chance for a rebound but doesn’t have it because of the foul…
Where is he going with that? To say that was a stretch is a huge understatement. What rebounds… The guy was in a clear offside while the ball was played in an area very near towards him. Every time I’ve watched a game before, that’s a stonewall offside, it cancels everything after that.
How in the world can you award Schar with a penalty while he was in a clear offside in that same one action? Webb is constructing a possible another action a rebound that doesn’t exist to justify the call… Absolutely nuts.
Awarding a player with a pen, while being in a VAR CONFIRMED offside position basically equals awarding him with a goal. What have we just witnessed here??
Obviously I don’t care about Bournemouth getting robbed here and this exact case, but this is just an example of how they think, operate and make desisions and shows they can construct any decision they want.