Coronavirus

[Gunnerpr]

@Aussiegooner

So basically we can all find different studies and data that have different opinions on the matter depending on where you look.

The only thing we do know is lockdowns destroy small business & hammer the large majority of peoples mental health.

My personal opinion is lockdowns do have a benefit to lowering covid numbers, but those lockdowns come at a great cost to other facets mentioned.

So you are of the opinion that if Australia did not have a 9month lockdown they would have the same number of COVID cases now as if there was no lockdown or even partial? I’m sorry but I just can’t imagine you actually think that is true

Are you suggesting in Wuhan, if they didn’t lockdown the virus would have stopped spreading just as quickly as with the lockdown?

Are you suggesting the same as the initial outbreak in Italy or in New York (insert any other area which had a huge spike in cases).

[Aussiegooner]

No I’m not suggesting that at all, I said my personal opinion is it does put a slow down to covid cases.

It also puts every 2nd small business with a for lease sign out the front also.

Lots of big business hasn’t really suffered at all though, with people at home making online purchases and all.

I’m still not sure what Australia’s end goal is though, border closures everytime a state gets a case or 2, covid isn’t ever going away so is this sort of thing going to happen forever ?

[Gunnerpr]

@BigWeng_4LYFE

Theres been plenty of science to support the idea that these complete lockdowns haven’t helped control the virus at all in fact they only increased the spread as of late because of the fatigue involved with them.

@Aussiegooner

My personal opinion is lockdowns do have a benefit to lowering covid numbers

I was responding to these comments.

Which is a completely separate viewpoint to the below and I whole heartedly agree with as well as for a whole host of other negative consequences both economic and social. But the end goal/aim is a separate discussion to the above.

@Aussiegooner

t also puts every 2nd small business with a for lease sign out the front also.

Lots of big business hasn’t really suffered at all though, with people at home making online purchases and all.

But also in my frenzy I didn’t realise you said DO as opposed to DONT. I already had you labelled, my bad. So point only stands fo BigWeng.

[BigWeng_4LYFE]

Its not a one size fits all solution, every nation has different cultures, and different geography, like New Zealand being pretty damn isolated. If you actually read the study I posted it never refuted that lock downs actually help stop the spread, what its saying is that over doing lock downs leads to fatigue and ppl who haven’t been effected by the virus saying fuck this. The study recommended different methods of dealing with the virus. 74% of the virus spread comes within the home because ppl are more lax with social distancing and mask wearing, 1% of spread has been attributed to eating out at a restaurant. Yet the restaurants are all closed (which in LA is a huge percent of small business and they employ a big chunk of ppl).

Belgium and the UK have had stringent lock down rules but why is the spread per capita worse than even here in the United States do you suppose?

@Aussiegooner great article here that covers it all:

https://www.aier.org/article/closing-restaurants-is-unscientific-and-dangerous/

[Aussiegooner]

Interesting read mate and those numbers reconfirm my thoughts it was such a shame to see so many small cafe’s and bars and small business in general go tits up.

[shamrockgooner]

Lockdown is what’s going to happen in a pandemic. I of course agree what a shame it is for business but there’s no debate to be had here, lockdown is what governments around the world are going to do. If we’d all followed the Aussie model to begin with we’d be much better placed right now with very low numbers + vaccine rollout. I’m angry more countries didn’t do this.

I hate lockdown, but nothing we can do about it.

[BigWeng_4LYFE]

@shamrockgooner

Lockdown is what’s going to happen in a pandemic

What other pandemic were there lockdowns in?

[Aussiegooner]

The midst of the Spanish flu pandemic we had 100k people at the MCG for a football Grand Final, a virus a lot more statistically deadly than covid-19 also haha.

[Aussiegooner]

I’m not sure the vaccine rollout will change anything in Australia to be honest, as soon as we get a couple of cases we go into border closures and potential lockdowns, the vaccine isn’t going to get rid of the virus.

Out of curiosity how’s the rollout going in Europe ? Anyone know how many people have been vaccinated in say England ?

[shamrockgooner]

Well I wasn’t around for it but there were varying lockdown measures during the Spanish flu pandemic from what I’ve read. My point wasn’t about history though, lockdown is the prevailing public health advice for a pandemic in the 21st century. It’s what is happening now and it’s gonna happen if we have another one in the future.

[shamrockgooner]

@Aussiegooner

I’m not sure the vaccine rollout will change anything in Australia to be honest, as soon as we get a couple of cases we go into border closures and potential lockdowns, the vaccine isn’t going to get rid of the virus.

If 70-80% of people have received a vaccine it will drastically change the decision making I’d bet.

[Phoebica]

@Aussiegooner

Anyone know how many people have been vaccinated in say England ?

Last report I saw a couple of days ago said over 12 million people in the UK have had their first dose.

[Calum]

Long Covid: The illness wreaking havoc behind the pandemic

They talk to 4/5 people here. Long covid sounds horrific. It seems there is no reason why anyone gets it aswell which is quite scary tbh

[Leper]

@Aussiegooner

The only thing we do know is lockdowns destroy small business & hammer the large majority of peoples mental health.

And that it kills people. But not anyone you think counts.

[Trion]

@Aussiegooner

The midst of the Spanish flu pandemic we had 100k people at the MCG for a football Grand Final, a virus a lot more statistically deadly than covid-19 also haha

And that’s the reason that virus survived longer than it should have.

I don’t see how it is a good argument. It works against you in this discussion.

[Aussiegooner]

Yeah I know lockdowns do kill people, it’s a shame.

[Trion]

@BigWeng_4LYFE

What other pandemic were there lockdowns in?

How many pandemics have we had of this level of infectiousness?

[Electrifying]

Yawn

@Electrifying

Look, whether you like it or not, no government is going to write off a chunk of their population. Even this Tory government, for all its awfulness doesn’t want say, 2% of the country’s population culled.

So nobody is just going to let this run, or ‘live alongside it’

So fucking get real about your choices you clowns. There is no ‘living with the virus’ AND going back to normal.

It’s either:

1. you eliminate it completely by shutting borders and getting back to normal within the country while having travel restrictions.

Or:

2. Let the virus run through the population and have periodic lockdowns every 3 or 4 months when health services threaten to be overwhelmed.

That’s your choices. Anyone telling you different is delusional.

How many times are you going to have these false arguments @Aussiegooner @BigWeng_4LYFE

[Aussiegooner]

The problem with coronavirus is it is more infectious as opposed to deadly hence it has really dragged on.

Things like Ebola and SARS were a lot more deadly hence died out as it would kill someone before transmission in many cases.

35 % of people with this virus tend to walk around Society oblivious to the fact they’ve even got it.

[arsenescoatmaker]

@Gunnerpr

For instance, a Imperial College London study published in the journal Nature found that some 3.1 million deaths had been averted due to lockdowns across Europe early on in the pandemic. “This data suggests that without any interventions, such as lockdown and school closures, there could have been many more deaths from Covid-19,” said Dr. Samir Bhatt, an author of Imperial College London study.

In theory if social distancing is properly implemented it can avert spread of the virus nearly as well as lockdown. In reality children and teenagers in schools act like a giant petri dish, as do people in confined working environments. As do gyms, bars, restaurants, cinemas, swimming pools, etc. Coupled with the fact you have a big movement in the west to be anti-maskers

Like anything in America, educational research is all about money. Whoever funded the reasearch will fund based on getting the result they desire.