2024 General Election

2015 - 2019 was a toxic, dysfunction and turbulent time in UK politics due to the slim referendum and the resultant fall out but everything after 2019 was par for the course and within the realms of what would expect.

FPTP brings stability to the government with a strong majority, the system has never been about having a stable executive or treating the PM as a presidential type figure who was spent to be in power for whole terms.

Its only really in modern times because of the undue influence of american politics in media, people equate the resignation of a PM as this major event in similar terms and impact as the resignation of a President. 1 or 2 executive changes are quite common within the life of a government term

I don’t regard PM changes as inherently toxic, but with France for example, users on this forum constantly praise the feistiness and willingness of its people to protest without actually digging deeper as to the issues that bring it to a head. We’ve never seen the equivalent the yellow vests protests or the political disclosure that comes with it. The UK government has never had to float a ban of far right/neo nazis parties that have a more than nominal chance of gaining legislative power.

At the end of the day, the political environment and discourse is quite mild in the UK compared to many continental governments, a big part of that is because the FPTP promotes moderation.

Sure that’s correct the national vote share doesn’t correlate to seats, that’s a national view to what essentially a local election to return an MP to Parliament. I agree FPTP doesn’t provide a 100% true reflection of voting intention, it largely does especially as it relates to majority ideological things the country faces whilst providing a clear view wrt accountability and giving the executive the power to act decisively.

I think your view is a little binary, parties amalgamate because of the nature of the system but parties exist within parties. There a high level of political pluralism within the two party structure which means people vote for whoever best represents their own ideology and even before as it applies to selection.

So much of British politics and FPTP is about indirect effect. It just the nature of PR advocates to minimise the localism aspect FPTP and assert thar votes are “wasted”. If Labour wins Bristol central but the Greens are few points in second, the people who voted green still have influence and sway over their MP.

Sure, in a literal sense but we’re a representative democracy, we don’t decide things on plural terms popular vote has no bearing on anything in a GE.

Reviewing most GEs in retrospect its easy to see why particular results were returned in light of the issues at the day. That’s more my point

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Fair enough. Its a pretty different point to the one I responded to.

We fundamentally disagree on how representative FPTP is, I’d disagree with or have something to say about just about everything you said in your post and I just cba to do it justice haha

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I’d like to read whenever you have idle time to write it.

I suspect you will busy this week getting ready for the Labour landslide under Daddy Starmer :sweat_smile: :wink:

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@sevchenko Fair points, but I think time will truly test your theory, Tories were flirting with culture war stuff quite a bit and I expect it to ramp up and there’s widespread dissatisfaction with immigration issues.

I consider the ‘moderation’ you speak of (Pre-2015). Was just the state of UK politics at the time. I don’t think the UK is really above all that stuff you’d say is toxic, seems like exceptionalism to me.

Fair enough if you don’t consider it toxic but I can’t see the benefits of the strong majority that FPTP brings when PM’s are resigning all the time and the acting government shuffles the deck. Potentially into something that wasn’t voted for.

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I could be mistaken, but I don’t think Bangladesh is even in the top ten for immigration/asylum into Britain these days. So it does, to me at least, raise an interesting question as to why he so deliberately decided to highlight Bangladesh.

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Would still be more stable than Truss.

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Yups, based in the UK

Finally just a few days to get the crooks out.

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Not that our newspapers are as influential as they once were (though try telling that to someone in the Westminster bubble and you’ll get a blank, confused expression).

So, supporting Labour.
The Times (yep)
The Independent
The Mirror
The Guardian

Tories
The Daily Mail
The Torygraph (natch)
The Express.

Still on the fence
The Sun

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The Sun just goes with the narrative at the time. Then all their stupid readers vote for that party

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Access journalism rules in this day and age. Got nothing to do with actually believing in Labour’s vision, it’s about having access once they’re in power (and also about appearing to be on the winning side). That’s why they’ve gone after the Tories much harder in recent weeks, because they know that about 85% of the morons who have held cabinet positions inrecent years about to be cast into utter irrelevance, never to return from the political wilderness, so who needs them anymore.

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Of course they are.

It’s on the others to put enough pressure on the big two to force more conversation and more debate for the change. Neither labour nor the conservatives will willingly open that door.

It’s not like brexit where it might actually get enough public sentiment or pressure from that angle either.

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Through the letter box today I received 1 SNP leaflet, 1 lib dem and 4! separate Labour ones

Don’t beg it Labour

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The Tories have gone quite hard on campaigning here. They’re begging South East England not to turn on them :grinning:

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I find it astonishing that Sunak thinks he can give us the “Labour will ruin the country” narrative after the 14 years we’ve experienced of Tory control lol.

I don’t think there’s been a worse time to live in this country in my life.

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Large majorities are only a problem if it’s a Labour one apparently. Though a look at how the Tories used their majority suggests otherwise.

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I got a Reform leaflet in the letter box earlier and did what every responsible adult should do and popped it straight in he recycling bin.
The only party to actually knock on the door and speak to me was from the Liberal party but as I said to him, I’m voting for you anyway so you might as well try somewhere else.

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She seems a bit naive and not really suited to a career in politics.
The Reform party have a manifesto built on racism and bigotry, what else did she expect from them?

Rishi Sunak tweets on his account are a good laugh