Is it a consequence of coaching?
This is all tinfoil hat stuff but we know that Arteta is obsessed with control. He (foolishly imo) doubled down on control between this season and last season when what we could have done was vary the attack more.
Is it possible he’s so worried about losing the ball that he’s encouraging players to make that extra pass or delay a shot in order to make sure if we do lose the ball or it’s blocked out, we’re not as easy to get transitioned on?
Considering we broke our personal record for PL goals scored last season, no.
I still think we have to give him the benefit of the doubt for time being…he was poorly coached at Chelsea and played in the wrong positions. The guys confidence has taken such a knock it is going to take time to repair. Confidence breads confidence, and at times this season we have seen this returning (as with his goal against Luton which was really instinctive).
I’m prepared to give the guy a break, but shooting and finishing are two things he really needs to work on (same applies to other players atm too!).
Yes I think that’s exactly it
Tiki taka smother them to death style
Yeah, Havertz hasn’t been bad imo, as much as I don’t like the transfer. But half a season in, I don’t know that it’s really proven to be an astute move.
Is he totally to blame for the drop off in form? Not totally but was it a great use of 65m during the summer? Not looking like it.
Isn’t a solution to the issues that needed addressing
Considering the fact we still need a CM, winger and striker question is why was he prioritised in the first place?
He is not to blame for the issues the team is currently suffering, it’s a collective issue but long term I don’t see him being a key player or foundational piece to the team winning big.
It’s like making a luxury signing after you’ve won a major trophy to change it up or introduce a new dimension, it’s not a move a club that is trying to get over the hump makes in direct response to a season where you came up short.
Well, as weird as it may sound he’s been one of our best players this season.
Gabriel, Saliba and Rice have been a class above everyone for me and then you have Odegaard with Havertz who haven’t hit insane levels yet but have been doing good.
White started the season really well but after his hamstring injury which he is still carrying he has dropped off a bit. Same for Saka but he’s a freak so his numbers haven’t actually dried up.
Tomiyasu looked great at one point too but injuries once again limited his involvement.
The rest have been meh. There’s players like Jorginho and Raya who have done ok. Same for Nketiah. But it’s nothing to write home about.
Then you have players like Martinelli, Jesus, Zinchenko, ESR, Vieira, Nelson, Trossard, Kiwior who have all been disappointing.
You can argue Martinelli and Jesus had some standout performances in the CL but that’s 3-4 performances out of about 30 games so far this season.
Let’s not go overboard. He’s had two horrible games, two really good games and the rest have been fine. Given the awful form we’re in, maybe that qualifies him as one of our best players but I wouldn’t say that.
I recognize that his average performances were likely due to learning a new system and new teammates.
But I still can’t help but wonder why Arteta and Edu thought it was a good idea to replace a very functional player like Xhaka with a completely position-less player like Havertz. He’s useful in the squad, no doubt about that, but there’s an opportunity cost to any transfer. We couldn’t make other moves in the market because we bought Havertz. We can’t spend money in January because we spent so much money on Havertz and have committed money to Raya. That’s almost 100m on two players that haven’t really taken the squad to the next level.
One of our best players? Nah, he hasn’t been
More a case of the forward line being an overall disappointment, he’s been right there with them. A month or of putting some good games together doesn’t change that.
Defence and to a lesser extent the midfield (mostly Rice) have been the best parts of the team this season, attackers have not produced to the same level.
I actually agree of everything you said except this one.
Kai is one of the most versatile attacking players on the team, and one of the players that have the best positioning and sense.
Yeah, I know, shit shooting…
Let’s be honest - he is a downgrade on Xhaka and that was a midfield that ultimately didn’t win the league.
He should be an extra body in the squad but not someone you can build a trophy winning team around. Arteta seems like he’s invested personally in the signing and if he can’t see it, then it’s hard not to question his judgment. I had a bad feeling when the signing was made…still doesn’t make any sense to me and if I’m proven wrong I’ll hold my hands up, but I don’t think I will be.
Still could be worse. We could have Timo Werner.
Nope.
Already contributed more to goals and assists and, in any of the defeats we’ve had this season, you’d have to be a brave man to say Xhaka would’ve influenced the result positively
Havertz has not contributed more to goals and assits than Xhaka did, right now he’s on a third of goal involvements compared to Xhaka last season and he defnitely doesn’t help us play football that is as good compared to Xhaka either, nowhere near.
Wondering how Xhaka could help this current team against low block teams that have 8-10 players in the box. There wasn’t even space and time to make any effective long shot; and there was no space to make any effect pass (or through pass), consider our front three are not big and strong.
To play a wide open game, Kai proved that he can contribute more, with or without goals.
In the CL, game, in the game against Pool last Saturday etc.
Xhaka no doubt is a better passer but it is mutual beneficial to him and the team that we were able to play free flow football, and all our attacking players were in form and hitting high numbers last season.
Fans missing Xhaka because of that, the style we played.
Realistically, if we put Xhaka in this 23-24 season, highly doubt he could contribute “more” than Kai.
I am serious about that.
Slow sidway possession game, we had that before. Under Wenger, under Unai, under Arteta. How did Xhaka do in a slow tempo game setup?
Funny how we have so many underperformers this season, from Zinny to Jesus and Martinelli but fucking Xhaka who was playing out of his skin up until the WC and then dropped off quite a bit after it would actually have actually kept up just fine this season.
Btw this Super Xhaka has 0 goals and 1 assists in all competitions, which includes Farmersliga, Farmers Cup and EL.
And before anyone says he transformed Leverkusen into title contenders. Leverkusen have been on the up way before Xhaka arrived there. They just continued from where they left off with Xabi Alonso and their talented youngsters being more mature.
Xhaka been a big miss this season. Doing well out in Germany.
Flip side to his supposed versatility is that he can’t make a position his own hence the versatile tag
He isn’t a solution to any of the postions he’s versatile in
He has a spot in Arteta’s plan, that’s the most important.
I didn’t mean that as a dig on him. He doesn’t have a true position imo. Neither does Thomas Muller and he’s been a really great player for a long time. It’s not always a bad thing. It just meant more of a project to figure out how to best integrate him into the team rather than buying someone with a more straightforward integration like Ruben Neves who is only a midfielder and not very versatile.
Edit: Not saying Neves was the correct path to go down or that he’s awesome (although I think he’s quite handsome). Just that he was a midfielder who also moved last summer.
