It was the right choice to let Wenger ( as you know I’d have done it around 3-4 years earlier and gone hard for Klopp) go it was just gradual decline that finally ended up with us missing the top 4 two years in a row.
We hadn’t got 80 points in the league since 2008, so Wenger had 10 seasons after that to mount a proper title challenge.
A club like Arsenal should have ambition to compete for the title so if a manager isn’t capable of doing that anymore you move them on.
I will concede I didn’t give Wenger enough credit in the initial period when we transitioned to the Emirates keeping us top 4 on a minimal budget.
It’s looking like our 2 appointments since Wenger haven’t worked out and intact sadly we’ve regressed even further and probably wasted another 3 seasons sadly. I do think we’d be doing a bit better currently with Wenger but this club needs to keep trying to find the right structures in place to challenge / win league titles.
As @JakeyBoy says I think we have to look at all 3 managers independently and just because Emery was a failure and things are looking grim with Arteta doesn’t mean we should regret change.
We were under the notion that Wenger held us back and if there is no progress post Wenger, was it really Wenger who held us back then?
These are not independent decisions. If the board decided to part ways with Wenger, they should have made sure there was something better planned post Wenger.
Until Emery came in with his presentation, Arteta was in pole position to become Arsenal manager.
Was Arteta really the upgrade over late stage Wenger at the time?
How can the club’s decision to let go of Wenger be justified if there was no plan for life after Wenger?
What sort of management is that?
You justify a decision by doing better else it was a bad decision.
Getting rid of him was a good idea. Then they fucked up by appointing someone who was shit when they could have employed someone who was good. Not sure there’s much more I can explain here.
So you’re mathematically wrong, sacking Emery for Arteta is bad, if Arteta isn’t better than Emery. And sacking Wenger for either Emery/Arteta is wrong because it’s a downgrade.
Conclusion: You should sack a manager for a better manager. Not for an equal or worse manager, the latter are both mistakes.
I’m sure in the loopy world of Ivan Cuntzidis and co, they did think they had made the right decision. Hell, most of the fanbase was excited at the prospect of Emery.
The simple thought process was “let’s sack Wenger and bring in somebody better”. The logic was sound but clearly it didn’t work out that way. Nobody is a seer, nobody knows how it was going to pan out.
But you simply cannot fuck with the logic used, and that in no way should ever be disparaged.
Wenger needed to go if for anything else to get rid of Gazidis.
Did a runner and left a patchwork structure (Sven, Raul amongst others are no longer here) to cover a big gaping hole in the club. Bullshitted about the interview process where the due diligence is dubious at best as they were starry eyed by a god damn presentation.
Because in his last season it all spiralled out of control. 13 losses, 63 points/6th place finish, toxic environment around the club, players seemed to have lost every bit confidence in Wenger. There was really no reason to think that was going to be turned around by Wenger. The decision to fire a manager is not just based on who the successor is going to be.
It seems however that for you, and two or three others, that 17/18 season simply doesn’t exist at all. Which means no point arguing really.
Not that it doesn’t exist but it was an extenuating circumstance. Wenger was for all intents and purposes a lame duck. The players had no accountability. Even with a terrible roster and the players giving up, our xG was still pretty high, we made a cup final and have all Simeone and a CL team could handle in the EL semi final, shoulda won the competition too of not for Laca being trash. So in the absolute worst circumstances Wenger still outperformed anyone who’s come after him. Give him a top back office staff and a couple years of Sven purchases and we are a very formidable side. Instead we blew it up and are shit. So meh.
It doesn’t amount for much because it wasn’t a proper environment for Wenger as well.
It became obvious that the board renewed Wenger’s contract after FA Cup win because they found themselves unprepared for the change.
They knew Wenger’s contract was finished that season but they didn’t prepare for it.
They renewed with the intention to prepare for his departure. Gazidis brought in Sven, Raul etc to offload Wenger’s powers and made it awkward within the team.
Wenger could have done better ofcourse but it wasn’t exactly noninfluence of an environment. They clearly wanted more from what Wenger gave us before they started making it toxic for Wenger.
Fair enough they did all the prep and informed Wenger he should leave. Make sense to buy yourself time to make a big decision.
What did they end up doing? Made a last minute decision within a pool of two managers - Arteta & Emery.
Excellent job that.
The logic is simple -
If you decide to sack our all time best manager instead of backing him financially, better make sure you don’t regress because of that decision.
It’s a simple logic and I don’t know how anyone can deny that. I have not even said anything stating that it has been a wrong decision. Still time to turn this around. But if we don’t, then we fucked up.
Hold your horses with that post you’re writing currently @SDGooner, you can make it in the Wenger thread once I’ve moved all these posts, but its easier for me to close the thread while I do.
No the board are justified in firing the manager if they do their best to appoint someone who is of a profile worthy to succeed, especially if the board has months or years to prepare for the same.
No one can guarantee success but you can understand a negative result if you believe the club did their best to hire someone who can give the confidence of success.
I don’t think a manager shortlist of Arteta and last minute presentation of Emery was the best Arsenal could do.
Do you believe Arsenal did their best?
If so, you deserve the current Arsenal predicament.
Fair too a degree but think the bigger problem was not being ruthless on Wenger at an earlier date.
Not recognised the game changing and stagnation at an earlier date. The European failings should of been the marker to measure the drop off by.
I think it’s well documented how I thought about the Emery appointment…blasted that one from the very start.
Again this notion ignores judging Wenger on how he performed and make decisions based on the performance of the actual person involved. Like happens with every job. Or it doesn’t ignore it I must say. You simply believe Wenger wasn’t at fault.
Wenger after the Leicester league season should not have renewed his contract.
I was always hopeful that Wenger would be finally backed financially and provided with quality players like Ozil and Sanchez in other areas as well.
But we all knew to some degree, a change was needed.
The board had time to do thorough process and hire someone with a good plan to back it up.
I supported Emery and I support Arteta as I want to see Arsenal do well but it looks increasingly like the change was made to appease fans rather than change made to plan for systematic progress.
Worst of all the management team themselves detoriated to mere Vinai & Edu.
The board failed atleast for first 2 seasons post Wenger, and they barely managed to match Wenger at his worst.
What? The change was made because 17/18 was a terrible season. If Arsenal didn’t perform so terrible that season he would probably have gotten the opportunity to finish his contract.
As @JakeyBoy has said. Letting Wenger go was the right decision on all accounts. Hiring Emery was wrong. But, again, by putting the focus on the succession like you’ve done consistently you try to distract from the Wenger-situation.
I have made myself pretty clear and I have been repeating myself.
If you can’t look past your Wenger hatred, I am glad Arsenal is doing shit atm because we have fans like you.
There is a certain joy to see you continue being miserable.